- - - Explain why Winston is both completely right and completely wrong in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles.
- - - "Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became the truth." Explain this passage from Part VII.
Winston is right and wrong about believing in any revolution must come from the Proles because the Proles are the only ones who really can start a revolution because the Part is to strong for only the citizens to take on but if the Proles help out they will have a better chance of taking down the Party. This passage shows that the citizens do not really remember their past and all the human emotions. The citizens are being told lies but they have no other option but to believe because if the do not follow the Party will either kill you or put you in a forced labor camp.
ReplyDeleteWinston is completely right about the proles having to start a revolution because they are the only ones that can. Big Brother basically has no control over them and encourages the citizens to leave them alone. The proles can do things that others can't do like prositution, gambling and many other things that would be considered thought crimes. Although Winston is completely wrong about this because they are incapable of starting a revolution. Most of them are too dumb to even think about starting one. Also they really couldn't because they really don't have a reason to do so. They can do whatever they want most of the time.
ReplyDeleteThis passage means that everything about everything is totally uncertian. I mean tommorow everyone could think that 2+2=5 and the sun revolves around the earth. Winston and the party members aren't even sure that gravity is real. Big Brother can have them believe what ever he wants them to no matter if true or false.
Winston is right in believing that any Revolution must come from the Proles since they are they take up 85% of Oceania. They would easily be able to overthrow the thought police and other party members. Proles also don't have as much surveillance over them since The Party doesn't think they are a threat to anything since they have no intelligence. Winston is wrong in believing the revolution must come from the Proles, however, because the Proles don't realize what The Party is doing, so they don't have a reason to rebel. The Proles live in poverty and squalor and are not very intelligent. The thought police are among the Proles many times in order to find and remove the ones that are too intelligent or too aware of the activity of The Party.
ReplyDeleteThe past is always changed in this society. The Party wants the past to seem perfect, so they change it to match present day. For example, one of The Party members was not loyal, they made up a new party member and replaced the disloyal party member's name with a new party member's name so that no document said that this disloyal party member was ever a loyal party member. Essentially, The Party is altering history so that it fits the "perfect past" that they have created.
Winston is completely right in saying that the Proles must cause the revolution. The Proles are the only ones who are secluded from society and have the ability to secretly discuss plans to overthrow the government. Their beliefs, thoughts, and actions are not being documented with telescreens in their homes which allows them freedom. Winston is also completely wrong in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles. The Proles are not active in society because they do not have to be. The government does not keep a close watch on them. This will stop the Proles development of hatred towards the party and the government. Without the hatred, they will have no desire to revolt against the party because that are not receiving the same invasive treatment as many others within the society. They are presented no reason to overthrow or cause revolution because they are left at peace. The Proles will also lack the knowledge needed to overcome Big Brother as they are secluded from society and not bothered by his presence or actions.
ReplyDeleteThis passage from part VII represents Winston's power. Winston knows that the party tries to hide the past, present, and future from the citizens of the country. He also knows that the government holds precedence over every aspect of majority of the population. However, Winston has a strong memory that provides him with a lot of information. He feels confident that this information is the key to the revolution because it will provide the evidence to prove that what the party is doing is wrong. "Concrete, unmistakable evidence of an act of falsification," is the representation that Winston holds information over the government.
1. Winston is both completely wrong yet completely right about the revolution having to come from the Proles. The Proles make up a huge part of the population, so if the Proles were behind the revolution they would easily be able to take down the Party just by numbers. Although, Winston is completely wrong because the Proles do not have the motivation to start a revolution because of the lifestyle they live.
ReplyDelete2. The quote from the novel means that the Party managed to erase the citizens' memories of how society was ran before the Party took over. By doing this, the Party was able to lie to the population and make the citizens believe them because they don't have any facts going against what the Party says.
Winston is correct about the Proles being the only ones that can begin the revolution because they are the only ones that know what true freedom is. They do not have to abide by Big Brother's strict rules and their every action is not monitored. They have freedom from the Party and are capable of making their own decisions about their lives. Because the Proles are allowed to make decisions of their own, they have the ability to show the citizens of Oceania how their life could be like if they revolted. However, he is wrong because the Proles do not necessarily know how strict the Party's laws are for everyone else. Also, they are isolated in their own land and do not have contact with anyone else. They keep to themselves and most likely do not want involved with anyone else because they are accustomed to this lifestyle. Also, if the Proles do know how bad the people of Oceania's lives are and know how powerful Big Brother is, they would not want to interfere and risk their own freedom. This is why Winston is right and wrong about the Proles initiating a revolution.
ReplyDeleteThis passage is explaining how Winston is sure that the Party is completely lying about everything they tell the people. Since his job revolves around altering facts, he has been exposed to all the lies the Party has been telling the people. When he thinks back to the time he received the article of the three traitors, he remembers then that that was the first time he knew for sure that the government was lying to everyone. In his own mind, he has the proof to take down the Party because the truth is no longer the truth, and no one can decipher the truth from a lie. This passage is explaining how after so may altercations to the truth, the lies being told to everyone are the only truth the people know, and they could not tell right from wrong when it came down to fact and fiction.
1. Winston is completely right about believing that a revolution must come from the proles because the make up the majority of the population. Like any revolution the majority can easily overthrow the minority, no matter how strong that minority is. If the proles grasped the idea that they could create change with their numbers the revolution would certainly start with the proles and work its way up. He is completely wrong about a revolution starting with the proles because revolutions do not start at the bottom. Revolutions start from the unhappy upper classes. Who then spread their ideas to those below them. The minority of the minority spark revolution and go on to lead the majority. The American revolution for example, the leaders were wealthy white males who were unhappy. They took ideas they formed and gave these ideas to the majority (lower classes), sparking a revolution. They same thing could happen in 1984. An unhappy party member (Winston for example) could portray ideas of freedom and equality to the porles who with their majority population could use the ideas given to them. The majority takes a spark from a smaller group and uses that spark to feed the flame of a revolution.
ReplyDelete2. This means that everything that happens after an event matters. The writing of history is done by those in control. They erased the true facts and pushed the idea of their agenda's version of the truth onto the people, Over time the people forgot the actual truth because there was no evidence to support anything but what the party said. Because there is no evidence besides the Party's evidence that version has to be accepted and it eventually becomes the truth known.
1) Winston is completely right in believing that a revolution must come from the Proles because the Proles are the only ones capable of overthrowing the Party. The Party almost completely ignores the Proles as long as they carry out their part. "So long as they continued to work and breed, their other activities were without importance." The Proles are able to do what they want and can escape from some of the Party's punishments. It is said that the Proles do not even have telescreens in their homes, and that civil police rarely bother them. If anyone is capable of a rebellion, it would be the Proles. Although Winston is correct in believing this, he is also wrong because the Proles themselves do not realize rebellion is possible. One of Winston's journal entries reads: "Until they become conscious they will never rebel, and until after they have rebelled they cannot become conscious." If the Proles are not thinking of rebellion, it is not possible for a rebellion to come from them. Winston also says that the idea must come to them sooner or later. The Proles may never come to see the idea of rebellion, so it wrong to hope for one from them. Winston's beliefs are completely correct in some aspects, but completely wrong in others.
ReplyDelete2) This passage explains the way the Party governs Oceania. The passage appears as Winston is thinking about everything the Party has told citizens. He tries to distinguish what is the truth and what is lies, but is unable to due to how much the Party has changed the past. Winston's job is to change and rewrite articles/speeches made by the Party and Big Brother. These articles are of predictions made in the past that are now incorrect. Winston's job demonstrates how the Party completely changes the past to make themselves appear better to the public. This also shows how "the lie became the truth". The erasure is the removal of writing, recorded material, or data. It is forgotten because the Party removes so much that it is nearly impossible to keep track of it all. Overall, the passage explains how the Party continues to control people even though they constantly lie.
winston is right in believing in the proles being able to start a revolution because the proles make up around 85% of the population in Oceania. There is strength in numbers and with those high of numbers they could conquer easily. However Winston is wrong because the proles lack in energy and interest to revolt against the party. In addition the proles don't even understand that they are being controlled by the party. This passage is introducing the event that occurred where Winston caught the Party in a dead on lie. He held the photograph in his hand for only few moments before he burned it, but those few moments were long enough to burn the memory into his mind.
ReplyDelete1. Winston is right about thinking a revolution has to come from the proles. The proles is what make up most of the population. Since there are more people in the proles it would be easy to over take anyone else. An unhappy person like Winston could give ideas of freedom and equality to the proles which they could then they would use these ideas Winston gave to them and put them into action. The majority of the population (the proles) would take these ideas from the smaller group (winston) and begin to start a revolution.
ReplyDelete2. The passage above means that everything that occurs in history matters. The facts of history are only writen by the government. The government manipulated events that occured, by only pushing their version of the truth onto the people. The people eventually forgot the actual truth because there was no evidence to support what they believed. Since there is no facts or history besides what the party portrays as evidence that version has to become accepted and will eventually become the truth known by the people.
Question 1: Winston is both right and wrong about his comment on the Proles. As readers know, the Proles are the biggest group of people in Oceania and have the most freedom of any class. Because of this, Winston believes that the Proles have the strength and ability to overthrow the Party. Winston is quite wrong, though. As the readers have seen, the Proles do not have as many restrictions because they will always obey Ingsoc. They are unconsciously loyal to the Party because of the use of propaganda. While the Proles have the manpower to take the Party down, they cannot successfully do it due to their willingness to obey and be loyal.
ReplyDeleteQuestion 2: This passage relates to the Party changing history. "Everything faded into mist." means that the truth (of history or anything, for that matter) became hazy and many forgot about it. "The past was erased," refers to Winston's job of erasing pieces of history. It is quite clear in meaning. "the erasure was forgotten," means that no one except for those who worked on it knew that history was being continually changed and even those who knew forgot about it. Finally "the lie became the truth." means that the Party implements this changed history into society and it becomes the truth. Overall, this passage shows how much power the Party has over society. They are so powerful that they can change history and no one cares. It also shows how easily convinced the people are by propaganda. Using a bit of propaganda, the Party can convince a whole society that a new piece of fake information is the "truth".
Winston is right in believing that the uprising should come from the Proles, because they are the working class. They have strength in numbers and are not strictly monitored; it would be easier to plan group meetings to discuss a revolution. Winston is wrong in the sense that the Proles act like animals rather than human beings. They are born, they work and they die. That is their life. The Proles never argue over anything sensible and have no reason to. As Winston wrote, "Until they become conscious they will never rebel, and until after they have rebelled they cannot become conscious."
ReplyDeleteThe passage above from Part VII vividly describes how lies become truth. The Party has the power to dictate what is written down in textbooks, newspapers and other sources of media. They can create and obliterate people. The citizens of Oceania do not keep track who and what is erased nor the person that completes the erasing. Everything seems to be behind a mist: making it difficult to distinguish what lies beyond the curtain of lies.
The proles live in freedom unlike the rest of the people. They are allowed to do liberal things that the Party doesn't accept but they still allow them to do it. Winston says that they are the only thing left with human traits and use the "Oldspeak". Yet O'brien believes that the proles will not turn against the government because they have everything so why would they change it. Winston struggles with going back and forth with the idea of the proles revolution.
ReplyDeleteBy this quote it proves that everything has been altered from being the truth to a lie. The Party manipulates the truth into making the people believe it is a lie
Winston is completely correct, however also very wrong. He is completely right, because they are important in this society and if they decided to revolt, the people would listen to them. Also, because they know the system very well so they are able to allow the people an insight into why this government is not working and what weak points they can pounce on. Also the people would listen to them because they have been listening to them for most of their lives so they would go along with them. This could also be completely wrong, because some might not listen to them. Some people might have bad feelings towards the proles, because they do not like the way they are doing things. Also because it will be hard to get them to revolt because they might like the way the government, or are afraid to revolt. The line "Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became the truth" there is a deeper meaning. This passage is talking about Winston and all his memories being there and then not being there. Explaining how the government took them and gave them something that erased the civilians past. The end of it saying "the lie became the truth." Means that Winston did not think that they would actually erase their memories, or that he did not think it would actually work.
ReplyDeleteWinston is wrong when saying that a revolution must come from the Proles because the Proles hold the least authority of all the citizens. They have the least significance, which is why they are compared to animals. Since these people do not have much say in the town, it is less likely that they can make a change or even lead a revolution. On the other hand, Winston is correct because the Leader and the Party cannot get rid of the Proles considering the civilization would die without them. The Proles are needed to reproduce children and without the children, the Leader would not continue to be as powerful as he is. Therefore, the Proles may be able to start a revolution knowing that even if it fails and they all die off, the population would die off as well. This passage is explaining how the Leader and Party controls the people. They cut them off from some knowledge, as those that work in the Ministry of Truth work to change all incorrect facts and opinions of the Leader before they reach the public. They correct his wrongs, erase people that go against their beliefs, erase history, and create an image of the world in whatever way they want. This shows how the lies are turned into the truth to the public.
ReplyDeleteWinston is wrong when saying that a revolution must come from the Proles because the Proles hold the least authority of all the citizens. They have the least significance, which is why they are compared to animals. Since these people do not have much say in the town, it is less likely that they can make a change or even lead a revolution. On the other hand, Winston is correct because the Leader and the Party cannot get rid of the Proles considering the civilization would die without them. The Proles are needed to reproduce children and without the children, the Leader would not continue to be as powerful as he is. Therefore, the Proles may be able to start a revolution knowing that even if it fails and they all die off, the population would die off as well. This passage is explaining how the Leader and Party controls the people. They cut them off from some knowledge, as those that work in the Ministry of Truth work to change all incorrect facts and opinions of the Leader before they reach the public. They correct his wrongs, erase people that go against their beliefs, erase history, and create an image of the world in whatever way they want. This shows how the lies are turned into the truth to the public.
ReplyDeleteWinston is both correct and wrong in believing a revolution against the party must come from the Proles. Winston is correct because the Proles are the biggest group and would need no further conspirators to overthrow big brother. They have the numbers to get the job done themselves without having to count on allies to help out which could very well lead to failure. However, Winston also couldn't be more wrong in this situation. The reason behind the Proles not rebelling is the party is kind towards them. They don't have restrictions on the Proles as they do for the rest of the citizens. They give the Proles freedom to follow the religion they choose and also other unalienable rights that the citizens under the party have not seen in forever. With this kind of treatment the Proles have no reason to revolt. They are worried about putting food on their table and following their religion rather than caring about how the party is acting towards the citizens. Winston is both right and wrong and again we see a hopeful and hopeless side relying on the Proles actions.
ReplyDeleteWinston is both right and wrong in believing that any revolution must start with the proles. Winston is wrong in the aspects that the proles are just a mindless and nameless mass of people that are ignorant and do not even realize that they are being subjugated by the government. They are too unintelligent to pose as any kind of threat. The Party basically ignores them, only adding working hours or shorter rations. As long as they do their job they are free, but they are too ignorant to realize the power of their freedom. There is also no need for them to revolt. With their freedom, their individuality and humanity remains. They are supplied with food, shelter, and entertainment, enough for them to survive until sixty. They have not seen any other kind of lifestyle but their own, so there is no need for them to revolt against the government. As far as they know, they live a happy and healthy life. On the other side, Winston is right because with the freedom the proles have, it leaves them with little to no surveillance from The Party. This allows them the ability to conspire any type of revolution. Majority of the proles had no telescreens in their homes, along with minimal interference from the civil and Thought-Police. If they were to become aware of their oppression by the government, they would have the power and numbers to ignite a rebellion without the probability of being caught or stopped.
ReplyDeleteThe passage from Part VII explains how The Party managed to rewrite and change history, and that eventually their lies became the truth. Over time, The Party and Big Brother constantly told the people their lies and stories of the past. At one point the people believed those lies and their memory of the past was erased and replaced with the new tell of history. With the past completely forgotten, the records and documentation of history were eliminated and rewritten in favor of Big Brother and the government. This terminated the chance of the people learning of the truth and challenging the government. As far as the people know, life has always been the way it was, and any time before that, such as the Revolution, was even worse. A time where capitalist ruled and everyone beneath them was else was their slave. The governments lies were so strictly instituted that they became the truth in the people’s minds.
If you break this passage down it becomes easier to understand. The passage is all based upon how the party covers up their lies and is able to manipulate the past so it becomes the truth. Therefore making all of the party's "predictions" a reality resulting in them never being wrong. This is another way they are able to continue to the brainwashing of the people. "Everything faded into the mist," means all of the memories and truths of the past begin slowly fading. "The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten," shows how the party takes back any newspapers and other sources of media given to the citizens in order to alter them. This altering occurs among the ministries where Winston works. The ministries change the past into what actually happened portraying that the party is always correct. Then after that it was like the erasing never occurred. Leading into the final part of the passage "the lie became the truth," after the erasing is final and it is forgotten the past is no more and what the party says is true are the only accounts of what actually happened. In reality this is equivalent to the U.S government attempting to cover up certain actions they don't wish the public to hear.
ReplyDeleteWinston has a point about the Proles being the most capable of revolting because they do make up a large amount of the population of Oceania, about 85%. They are very capable of gaining the strength to take over Oceania and defeating the police. Winston is wrong to believe that they would revolt though because the Proles are quite clueless when it comes to the party. They lack the means to want to revolt, that Winston looks past, and they also don't have the energy to.
ReplyDeleteWinston explains in this passage that there is no real evidence of the Party not telling the truth. Everyone's memory was taken away. They past events that have happened have been whipped from record and no one things differently. But here Winston also states that he is confident that he has the evidence to prove the Party is wrong. He believes that he possesses the knowledge to bring them down, but his evidence is only in his memory. He wants to prove to everyone just how controlling the Party is.
Winston believed the Proles were the key to the revolution because it was true. The Proles had the greatest population and held the greatest power. They were the majority and the forgotten, and because the government does not monitor them, not as many were vaporized. They symbolize what the government was trying to suppress, free will. The people in the Proles are unsupervised and unruly. This is shown by the lack of the telescreen in the store. The antique store is allowed to sell items that Winston saw as highly illegal. The Proles had the manpower and free will to revolt, but Winston is also completely wrong. The people in the Proles, although they have free will, do have the ambition or leadership to revolt. There minds are not controlled, but they are not intelligent either. They learned to survive under Big Brother and it appears that they have accepted their fate. When they are bombed, people hardly react. Winston simply walks away as if it is a daily occurrence, which it possibly may be. The government knows that they are the key to revolution just as Winston does so they keep them fearful. In that way, the Proles would never revolt because they have no reason to and they fear the Party.
ReplyDeleteThis passage of 1984 describes what the Party did to the people to control them. The mist was created by the Party to manipulate the past. Eventually people stopped knowing what was the truth and what was a blatant lie. The whole passage is about manipulation. If someone can change the past, then they control the future. Eventually, if a government tells enough lies, then they become the truth because the people know nothing else. “Mist” is pulled over their eyes and that is what Winston is describing.
"Until they become conscious, they will never rebel, and until after they have rebelled they cannot become conscious" (Orwell 75). The Proles are instrumental in an uprising against the regime. They make up the majority of the population, so by sheer number they should be able to overwhelm Big Brother. The group is also less monitored by the Thought Police, so they have more of an ability to sneak around, congregate, and make plans without Big Brother discovering their conspiracies. The regime does not think they are a threat, therefore allowing them more freedom than other classes. History shows that when governments are too lax or weak, the people have a greater chance of rebelling. They do not effectively control the people, and therefore, the people have room to rise up against them. In the French Revolution that began in 1789, for example, Louis XIV and his wife Marie Antoinette completely disregarded the peasants' needs. The peasants, with barely any food or money, were angered. Because the king and queen were so concerned with the dealings of the aristocrats and the royal court, they did not police the peasants very well, which led to them rising up and eventually executing them both. So it could be with the Proles and Big Brother. However, the Proles are essentially too stupid to realize what power they could potentially wield over Big Brother. Revolutionary leaders are usually of the educated middle class, yet in Oceania, Big Brother has total control over what people learn. Therefore, potential leaders are people like Winston, who remember that things were different and are not completely brainwashed, though these people are still too much controlled by fear to speak out. Those who do, like Goldstein, as well as Jones, Aaronson, and Rutherford, have a villainous persona plastered onto them with propaganda from the regime and are executed as soon as they are within grasp of Big Brother. There lies an absence of an intelligent, charismatic leader with great oratorical skills, who can stay alive and relevant long enough to lead the revolution. With no leader, the Proles will neve become conscious of what they can achieve. Additionally, the Proles are too worried about basic survival and necessities to be interested in rebelling. History has also shown that when people are materially comfortable enough, rebellion occurs. Because Big Brother controls the rations and the economy, the Proles are too concerned with obtaining needs just out of their hands, like razors, or the pan in Winston's market story. Until they receive these, they will not think about rebellion because they will need money and materials to fuel it that they do not possess even for their own families.
ReplyDeleteWinston speaks of the Party's brainwashing techniques. Because they are so intensive and frequent, Big Brother has completely changed the past to support his control over the people. The changes are promptly forgotten by the people because they do not have any evidence to prove or disprove their claims, and as a result, lose hope and do not try to convince others. Eventually, the people who knew true from false just accept the new information as true. That generation dies, and the next is brought up with the belief that the information is the truth and has never been changed. The children of Mrs. Parson, Winston's neighbor, are this next generation. Most of Winston's generation has already either forgotten, or accepted, it as the truth and embraced the Party's ideals.
The proles make up a huge population in the society. Unfortunately that are not motivated to start a revolution. This is because of the life style they live. Winston needs all the support he can get and all the people he can obtain. The meaning of the passage is that the people could not question or go against the state. There were no facts to prove them wrong or memories because they were all erased. The people were brainwashed by the state into doing whatever was requested. The people did not know right from wrong, they think everything is right when it comes to the states.
ReplyDeleteWinston is completely right and completely wrong in believing the Proles can create a revolution. He is completely right when dealing with the shear percentage of the population of Oceania. The Proles making up 85% of the population means it would be nearly impossible to control. Also, no authorities pay great attention to them so being able to drop hints within the Prole community to form a group to the lead a rebel group would not be hard. The simple example of woman fighting over saucepans shows the ability to fight is present. Winston is equally and completely wrong as well. The Proles will never rebel: they have no reason to rebel. The book mentions how the Party says Proles and animals are free. Although under the same government, they're left free to do what they want when they want and what pleases them. They're allowed to gamble, partake in sexual activities, and other impermissible things among everybody else. The Proles do not contain the conscious to be the force behind a revolution and the ones who could lead one, the Thought Police seem to take care of them before they're a problem.
ReplyDeleteThis passage means that all the hard facts that used to be, have been broken apart and scattered into nothing. All things that have been eliminated can no longer be recalled. Nobody has recollection of what used to be real because history has been forever changed by the Ministry of Truth. Whatever is published for the people to read and what is stated in text books for children is what is deemed as the truth. There is no way to prove a lie is a lie without hard evidence to back it up. That's simply what the Party has managed to accomplish.
Winston is both completely right and wrong when it comes to believing that the revolution must come from the Proles. The Proles are not afraid of the Party, they live in freedom unlike others who follow everything the Party does. People in the Proles are allowed to things that the Party would not allow them to do. O'brien believes that the Proles will never turn against the government because they have everything that they want and don't follow the party, why would they want anything to change. Throughout this Winston doesn't hesitate to switch sides.
ReplyDeleteBy this quote you notice the Party comes off to lead the people to believe that everything they say is the full truth, but everything that day is somehow twisted.
Winston is both completely right and wrong when it comes to believing that the revolution must come from the Proles. The Proles are not afraid of the Party, they live in freedom unlike others who follow everything the Party does. People in the Proles are allowed to things that the Party would not allow them to do. O'brien believes that the Proles will never turn against the government because they have everything that they want and don't follow the party, why would they want anything to change. Throughout this Winston doesn't hesitate to switch sides.
ReplyDeleteBy this quote you notice the Party comes off to lead the people to believe that everything they say is the full truth, but everything that day is somehow twisted.
Winston is correct about dealing with the population of citizens in Oceania. 85% of Proles make up the population, which would make it extremely hard to control. The Proles don't have people watching over them all the time, authorities aren't paying much attention to them, so it would be easy for them to create a rebel group. However, Winston is wrong because the Proles will never fight. They are not the people to start a fight or lead one. Also, the Thought Police get to them first so it wouldn't ever be an issue.
ReplyDeleteThis passage means that everything is lost. Nothing can be remembered. Nobody remembers anything because the Ministry of Truth has changed everyone's thoughts on history. The Party can hide as much information as they want or need because nobody knows the actual truth behind anything.
Winston is completly right in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles because if they did rebell, they could begin to marry each other and have families. There kids could be kept from them Party so they could rid the Junior Spies and Anti-Sex groups. Currently, they are not allowd to have any children or have any emotional relationships. Having these families would allow for a start of any type of alliance to begin to work againest the Party. Winston is also completly wrong in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles because even if he spoke to someone about how the Party is lieing to everybody, they might not believe him. The Party already has so much power and by changing all the doecuments of past events has already made them look like the perfect group. Everything the people do on a daily basis seems normal to them. Winston would have to make someone completly trust him and not turn him into the Party to do this which is highley unlikely to work.
ReplyDeleteThis passage from Part VII is the doubtful hopes of any revolution to get the country back to normal. It is now too late and the Party has erased all the past records and changed them all to what they want the people to hear. They brainwashed all the people in Oceania and no one will ever know what the real right from wrong is. Winston still sits in recollection of his past memories with his departed wife and is depressed because there seems to be no hope.
Winston is right about the Proles because they have more numbers than the Party, which makes a huge difference in a rebellion between them and the Thought Police. Since Proles make up 85% of the population, and having other rebels on their side, they could easily win a rebellion through numbers. Although, the idea of rebelling is so farfetched considering that very little of the Proles feel that the government is oppressing them. If they have no knowledge of what is truly going on, then their thought would be that there is no need to start a rebellion if they do not know the situation. The Proles also live brutish, ignorant, and barbaric lives, so convincing and providing knowledge about the situation and starting a rebellion with them would be difficult.
ReplyDeleteThe passage from part VII means that truth cannot be changed by a group of people, although it can be twisted. When the wrong person is holding the power of identifying truth and false, one can lose their freedom of being able to decide between the two. In their society everything is taught that their customs have always been like this, but it has not. Winston realizes that the government has been brainwashing the citizens for the entirety or their lives.
Winston is both right and wrong in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles. He is correct in saying this because the Proles take up a large portion of the population and remember the most about the past. The Proles also aren't watched as much as others because the party doesn't see them as a significant threat. Winston is also wrong in believing this because the Proles are not very smart and don't realize that the party is all evil. They don't have the motivation to lead a revolution and if there is one who is smart enough to, the thought police will kill him or already have.
ReplyDeleteThis passage is stating that the Party is brainwashing the citizens into believing that nothing existed before the Party. They do this in order to keep their power and to stop people from becoming suspicious of what the world really used to be like. They have no choice but to believe what the Party tells them because they have nothing else to believe if they never knew of anything else.
Winston is right because the Proles are the most populous class in Oceania. Since they are the working class, they are all connected by characteristics: manual labor, life time in poverty, and expected life span of sixty. So they have the worst of a bad situation in their society ; therefore, they should unite to create revolution. On the other hand, the proles functions are to work and reproduce, and they ars typically not educated, so the Proles would not understand their exploitation of their lifestyle. When they would not understand what they would be fighting for, there would be no want to organize resistance. From this the Proles are inferred to be nearsighted they mildly care about home, family ,and neighbor quarrels when Winston observes social distress over saucepans instead important social conditions. In addition, thought police plant rumours and fear among the proles where their reactions point out who would make trouble to the party and they "disappear" . In all Winston is wrong because the Proles are easily distracted and the party intimidates them with rumours of the thought police, but he is also right because the party doesn't bother to brainwash the proles-whose population is the largest class.
ReplyDeleteThe first two sentences refers to how Oceania's population has almost completely forgotten life before the party and big brother were in charge because of propaganda and eliminating resistance. Then when the party used propaganda and changed the records so many times, the truth becomes hard to distinguish. Since the party is lying most of the time, then how could they tell the truth when lies become normal. This passage is centered on Winston's inner question whether this operation of lies is the source of Oceania's people's opression. His experience in the records tells him it's true, but he destroyed his evidence to avoid his exposure to the thought police.
1. Completely right: the prices are terrible and the hope for a better future is something they would definitely fight for. They have nothing to lose and everything to gain at this point. London has the largest population in all of Oceania.
ReplyDeleteCompletely wrong: Proles are extremely suppressed and uneducated. Organizing a revolution would require some form of support from the upper class.
2. The Party manipulates the past and sometimes even completely destroys it in order to eliminate any curiosity about what was and to keep control of the people. They make it seem as though Oceania has always been that way. As long as the Party claims that nothing has changed then everyone just assumes this is how it's always been and no one questions the leaders because that's all they know.
Winston is right in believing in the proles for the revolution. He thinks this because they make up about 80% of the population so if they would agree and want to rebel they could easily take over. Another reason why they could help is because they are not watched by the telescreen/party. Also they are allowed to freely talk to one another sort of not worrying what the party thinks of them. This is why Winston is right in believing that the proles could help with the revolution
ReplyDeleteThis part of the passage is talking about how the regulations are finally taking over. There is no hope anymore that they can be free. They are starting to forget their past before the party and are starting to believe the lies that they were brainwashed to believe
Winston is correct in saying that the proles will start the revolution. He is correct becuase the proles make up most of the population of Oceania. This could help the revolution because if most of the population is behind a revolution, there is a greater chance of success. However, he is wrong because the proles most likely won't act. Even if they did attack and revolt, a middle class type such as the proles wouldn't have the money to complete a revolution.
ReplyDeleteThis passage explains the broken civilization that Winston lives in. This passage essentially summarizes what has happened to the history of Winstons world's past. This explains that the truth has been covered in lies that the people will tell you so that the population thinks everything is ok.
Winston is correct in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles. As it says in the book, the Proles comprise eighty five percent of Oceania's population which would be most logical for them to start a rebellion. Winston believes they have the power to overthrow the party because it can't be done from within. Winston is also completely wrong in believing that a revolution must come from the Poles. In the novel, Winston reflects on how the Party has claimed to have liberated the proles from the bondage and slavery of capitalist society, when in actuality the proles still live in poor conditions like the rest of the citizens of Oceania and go through the routine of everyday work and life. The Thought Police are always among them, looking for those deemed too intelligent or too aware of the Party's activities, and removing them from society.
ReplyDeleteWinston is saying that all memory is lost of their past. But we were meant to learn from our mistakes through history because that is our nature. People will never learn if all they do is change the past to fit their needs in the present and to secure their future. Then, whoever is the controller of people's minds, controls how they perceive the past and the world in general.
Winston is both completely wrong and completely right in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles. He is wrong because the Proles are not intelligent and do not understand that the Party is the enemy. They do not have the motivation to start a revolution especially because the Thought Police kills all of the intelligent ones. However, he is completely right because the Proles occupy a large portion of the population and remember the past well. Also, the Party does not watch them as much as the others because they do not see them as a threat.
ReplyDeleteIn the passage from Part Vll, it states that "Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became the truth." The concept of this passage is to explain how the Party is attempting to convince the citizens that nothing existed before the Party. They brainwashed their citizens in order to keep control and power over them through propaganda and physiological manipulation. The Party demolishes almost all physical records, photos, and documents because they do not want the citizens to know about certain aspects of history. They alter the history so the citizens do not have any suspicion and this makes them have no choice to believe anything other than what the Party says.
Any revolution had to come from them Winston explained. They had the numbers (85% of the population) and could freely communicate unlike like party members who would get vaporized if seen whispering. They aren’t bombarded with party statistics, slogans and ideals, but since they aren’t informed, they don’t know what’s happening. Even though they have the numbers and collective power, they don’t see what’s happening like most people, in the party or not. They’re actually like a different species which has little contact with the party and little reason to have contact with them. They go about their own business. They are the remnants of what life used to be, but the only reason that the party members don’t see them as hope (if they don’t believe in the party like Winston) is that they are considered inferior animals.
ReplyDeleteThis passage is explaining how everyone is living. The party has erased everything that would lead people to defy them from people’s memories by slowly changing it as people forgot. They are the only ones allowed to keep records. Anyone who remembered anything and tried to tell people wouldn’t be believed and then would be vaporized. This act continued for a few decades. Eventually, everyone’s mind was a blank slate that could be told anything about the past and believe it. So much changing of the past had occurred that no one knew what was lies and truth, so everything became truth. An example of this was in a copy of the children’s history textbook. Nearly everything it said about the capitalists of the past was completely made up, but everyone thinks it’s true, because they are taught at a young age. No one can fix their mistakes if they have nothing to learn from in the past.
Winston is completely right in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles. The Proles make up eighty-five percent of the population of Oceania. They have power in numbers over the Party. There is no other group that could overthrow the Party. The Party cannot be overthrown from within and any enemies had no way to come together or identify each other. WInston is also completely wrong in believing that any revolution must come from the Proles. The Proles are not strictly monitored or controlled by the government, so they lack the desire to take down the Party. They are not conscious of their own strength and ability to take down the party. Winston wrote, "Until they become conscious they will never rebel, and until after they have rebelled they cannot become conscious". This contradictory statement shows that the Proles will never be able to rebel because they will only become conscious of their abilities once they rebel against the Party, but they need to be conscious of their strength to rebel in the first place.
ReplyDelete"Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became the truth." This passage is describing the past of Oceania before the war. All memories of that time have been altered or erased. There was no telling what actually had occurred in these times because all facts that went against the government were destroyed. Everything was changed to make the Party look like the hero.
1. Winston is completely right because the proles might be able to rebel at anytime if they wanted to against the government. Winston is also wrong because the proles are way too weak and poor to rebel. They don't have the resources to rebel against the government. This is like a modern day homeless person that wants to make a change, most people don't pay attention to them if they were to rebel, just like Oceania and the proles.
ReplyDelete2."Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became the truth." This passage basically means that the government wiped their past memories and emotions and replaced them with something that they can control the people by. The past was erased and was replaced by the lies of the government. They people's memory was replaced so the lies of the government are the only thing the people know, causing them to believe it is the truth
Winston is completely right in the way that proles are the only ones that can revolt. They aren't under tight restrictions like the rest of the party. They have freedom, and even the leaders say that "Proles and animals are free". However, the Proles won't ever revolt because they have everything they could ever want. They are simply not intelligent enough to want to revolt. They don't see the corruption, the wrongs of the party, or anything beyond their needs.
ReplyDeleteThis passage means that the party got rid of everything except their lie. Everyone believes them because they erased everything else. Even if someone were to remember, and know that they are correct, they would have no way of proving it. They would be vaporized for thought crime if they persisted. With no proof, and only proof of the party's lies, the only thing that CAN be proven is what isn't true, therefore the past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, and the lie became the truth.
He is completely right because the Proles are not noticed by the Party. This would be an advantage they have over others that are constantly being watched and controlled. The Party thinks the Proles aren't capable enough to make a difference or cause a change. Also they Party thinks they are to stupid to brainwash therefor they could have a better knowledge of things that the Party doesn't want the others to know. Winston believes they could have some effect because they make up 85% of the population. He is also completely wrong because the Proles are thought of as not smart enough to worry about so they would get no attention.
ReplyDeleteThis means that if someone changes the past and continues to manipulate history, eventually those changes are taught to be the truth. The new information that was given is told to be the truth. The history in the past is never talked about or taught and once nobody talks about it or learns about it...it will eventually never be talked about again and forgot about. The Party brainwashed the past away from people and the history was never talked about after that, there for all the information that the people are getting is now THEIR truth but actually isn't true.
part 1-
ReplyDeleteFor a revolution to occur it must come from the proles. The reason it must is because nobody expects them to do anything. The party is not even concerned with them and what they are doing. If they rebel they will be shocked and unprepared and the rebellion will be successful. This statement is also untrue because the proles do not appear to have the education and skills necessary to carry out this plan
part 2-
By this quote it proves that everything has been altered from being the truth to a lie. The Party manipulates the truth into making the people believe it is a lie. They do this by brainwashing people as well as altering the past to make it seem as if everything they do or say is true no matter the circumstance
Winston is right about revolution coming from the Proles because they are the ones who physically change the information. If it wasn't for them then everything would remain the same. Winston is also wrong about this. The Ministry controls all changes. They are the ones who assign the jobs to the Proles. Therefore the Proles do as they are told, its not their choice.
ReplyDelete"Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became the truth" is about how all the incorrect information just simply vanishes without a trace. You cannot prove any of the facts being untrue once they are changed because all other information is thrown into the furnace and burned. The only thing left to prove the information false is memory but that isn't good enough evidence to fight against the Ministry.
Winston is completely right and completely wrong in believing the Proles can create a revolution. He is right in understanding the occupancy of the society. He realizes the percentage of the population of Oceania. The Proles make up 85% of the population which means all of them combined would be hard to control. Giving them subtle clues would not be difficult because the authorities don't pay much attention to them. A rebellion is not as hard as it may seem. The society's willingness to fight is very evident by the simple controversy over woman fighting over saucepans. Ultimately Winston is wrong though. In reality the Proles will never fight. Proles and animals are free, they can do what they want and what pleases them. The government reacts very differently towards them. The Proles don't have the severe want or need to lead this rebellion.
ReplyDeleteAny facts that are sure are now eliminated. Anything that is eliminated can never be regained. Any good memories or thoughts that could influence you in anyway will no longer exist. The Ministry of Truth changes lives for the worst. The truth can never be proven the truth, and a lie can never be proven a lie. Things that are published in books or newspaper is what the government wants the people to know. The way they treat the society like children is degrading and exactly what they wanted to accomplish.
Winston is completely right because the proles (middle class) make up the largest percentage of the population. So in theory what the large majority choose is what would happen. He is completely wrong though, because the ones with power are a small percentage of the population but have all the power and control over the people. So he is right in theory. But wrong in reality.
ReplyDeleteThis passage in part 7 Winston talks about about how the truth is erased and forgotten. Once the truth is gone the lies become the truth very quickly. Once the lies are the truth no one can trust anyone. So people start truth those in power because they "know best".
Winston is completely right and completely wrong due to the process of elimination and rational facts based on the situation. Looking at the situation there are only two groups of people in which revolution can occur, the proles and the party. The party will not rebel because it is too tightly controlled, and so no amount of adaquet information can be passed in order for a revolution to be staged. The preoles then are the only option, but looking at rational facts, they are too heavily oppressed that they cannot realize they can rebel. And there are government agencies in place to keep them oppressed and their thought controlled. So after looking at his view on the situation and being a reader. The only actual way that a revolution would be led is if a source from outside the proles informed some proles of what was occurring within the party and their chances of success in revolution. This could come from winston and his book, because his thoughts are written down.
ReplyDeleteThe meaning of Winston's quote goes into detail on the fact that history is controlled by the party. The quote describes how something was changed by the party and immediately, the populace has no remembrance of anything else besides that, and that it has been that way for as long as they can remember. And if there was a before time, it was always worse than now. Therefore, even though it was a lie that was spread it was readily accepted as truth. The only person who knows the real truth is winston because of his memory, which is even faded a little. Therefore we are basing our entire analysis off guesswork and uncertainty. But we must accept these possible falsehoods and as truth. Therefore that quote not only applies to the populace and Big Brother but winston's memory and the reader, except the reader has knowledge of the real world, but for the story only has what Winston's memory will allow.
Winston is both completely right and completely wrong in assuming that the revolution must come through the proles. Winston is right guy in assuming this for a few reasons. The proles make up 85% of Oceania's people, so they have plenty of strength in numbers. The proles also have little to no monitoring over them, so they would easily be able to organize a revolution. The proles, for the most part, don't have telescreens in their homes, and occasionally have patrols, but they are separated from the Party psychically, socially, and emotionally. Winston is also completely wrong though. The proles are highly uneducated and don't understand that they have the power to fight back. The proles also don't clamor over much of anything except the lottery, so focusing on something else would likely be difficult for them.
ReplyDeleteEverything faded to mist means that any knowledge nowadays has become so "clouded" that it is hard to see through or understand. The next line means that the Party erased the past, so now, anything that happened before a person's lifetime is virtually unknown to them. The lies became the truth is implying that the Party's lies are thought of as true, because the citizens have no knowledge that would lead them to believe something different is true.
Winston is completely right about revolution lying within the proles for many reasons. The proles make up the majority of the population and therefore it would be easy for them to over power the government. These are the most likely people because they should be the most unsatisfied. The proles live in poverty and ruins of past buildings. They are also the least monitored by the government. These people do not have telescreens and are not beaten down with constant propaganda and two minutes of hate. The proles are the least of the Party's worries because they believe the trouble lies within the educated upper class. All of these reasons cause the proles to be a good source of revolution. Winston is also completely wrong about the proles being the source of revolution. These people would rather fight with each other over shortages in pots than the government. The priorities, within the proles, are on surviving and making a living rather than an uprising. The proles also lack intelligence. These people do not see what the government is doing nor do they care. Because the proles are the least regulated, they have no real reason to uprise. They are content with attacking each other and finding their next meal for the time being.
ReplyDelete"Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became the truth." means that there is no more past. The past has been altered and no longer exists. By saying the erasure was forgotten, Winston is saying that the person or reason behind the alteration is no longer in existence. The past in Winston's society has changed so many times that the lie have become truth. No one can distinguish between the falsified records or the real ones anymore. The Party manipulates the past for its own use. It causes the citizens to be reliant on the government for information because they do not know what has happened in the past. History is the key to changing the future without it nothing will change. This is essentially what the Party is doing. The erasure of history being forgotten causes the lie to become truth. Winston is unable to speak to the person who altered history and find out what was changed. This causes history to be lies that were made into truths.
Winston sees how the proles could be the answer. The proles to us readers look like a large group that could come together for the cause. They are middle class people that go through society corruption. But Winston is completely wrong due to the dehumanization of the people of this society. The proles are to uneducated to put the revelation together. They go on living without giving question or seeing the corruption from the government. With the quote from Winston this means that society is controlled entirely. Everything that is linked to the people is erased. Anything that could make the people have emotion or any ties to a revolution or question is erased. The party is in control of what the people know. This is what they are trying to accomplish. What they put out and say is filled up by the people and always assumed to be the truth. The truth can not be dis-proven because the party can change the past and make anything the truth. This makes a lie not a lie. This is what the party wants.
ReplyDeleteWinston sees how the proles could be the answer. The proles to us readers look like a large group that could come together for the cause. They are middle class people that go through society corruption. But Winston is completely wrong due to the dehumanization of the people of this society. The proles are to uneducated to put the revelation together. They go on living without giving question or seeing the corruption from the government. With the quote from Winston this means that society is controlled entirely. Everything that is linked to the people is erased. Anything that could make the people have emotion or any ties to a revolution or question is erased. The party is in control of what the people know. This is what they are trying to accomplish. What they put out and say is filled up by the people and always assumed to be the truth. The truth can not be dis-proven because the party can change the past and make anything the truth. This makes a lie not a lie. This is what the party wants.
ReplyDelete1) He's right because the Proles have the most say and freedoms, there is an abundant amount of them. He is wrong though because they wouldn't have enough money to cause an uprising.
ReplyDelete2) This quote shows that there is nothing that is certain. Everything that has occurred could be a lie. The Party has taken control of all the facts and altered them to please themselves. All papers are destroyed so the Party can't get caught in their lies also.
Winston is completely right and wrong about the Proles. Their numbers alone are what would make them strong enough to over come the party. Without the Proles a revolution wouldn't have the strength to overthrow the party. You would think that the Proles would rise up since they live in unhealthy and poor conditions, but their minds are so consumed with useless thoughts that they wouldn't be able to come together to actually form a rebellion. Winston had said that they would never be conscious until they rebel and they couldn't rebel until they escaped unconsciousness. The Proles are too consumed with petty problems like the Lottery to realize how corrupt their government is. Winston was right in thinking that they had the man power to overcome the party, but he was wrong because the Proles could never take control and make a change.
ReplyDeleteThe quote from this part is very important to understanding how the Party controls its people. " Everything faded into mist. The past was erased, the erasure was forgotten, the lie became the truth." This essentially explains how no one revolts and tries to go back to the way things were. No one remember the way things were. Their history, and their pasts were wiped from their mind so that there could be no thought of revolt, and so that the Party was the only thing they've ever known. This quote is saying that the past is alterable and it can be believed as the truth. The Party is able to completely vaporize a person and create any lie they want and it will become the truth.